In the second part of this in-depth interview, Xebat Andok, member of the KCK Executive Council, spoke about both the rhetoric of the Turkish mainstream media and that of the opposition press. He talked about the interest of the international media in conducting interviews.
The first part of the interview can be read here.
The developments are accordingly difficult to understand, as the state is talking about a process, while its press continues to stick to the same old rhetoric. It still refers to a ‘terrorist organization,’ continues to use the same rhetoric regarding Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan, and presumably doesn’t even attempt to engage in dialogue with you. How do you read this?
They spread so many falsehoods and paint a false picture of the world. Without even attempting to portray reality or seek our opinion, they talk about us day and night in their programs. For example, the DEM party is representative of the Kurds and within direct reach of these media outlets. They could include them, but instead they prefer to talk about all sorts of things. They are so closed-minded, arrogant, and consider themselves so important that they think it is their right to make up and spread all sorts of things. They could include the DEM party in their programs. There’s no need to even mention what they spread about us. What does that trigger in us? That’s not a question for individuals, but for society as a whole. Because of their lies, many comrades are angry and no longer watch their programs. Many of our comrades feel this way, but we still need to follow what the ruling media is saying and what is being discussed in Turkey. So, we watch it by setting aside the emotional aspects and balancing reason and emotion. This does great harm to society. Essentially, people feel sorry for it. We have a philosophical foundation, a perspective. Because of the lack of alternatives, people are following these media as if it were telling the truth.
The state has effectively taken over every aspect of life like a monopoly. For example, the cultural and artistic sphere… Especially the AKP government did this very effectively. There are certain institutions that constitute the state. The government has created its roots there over time. They have gained some power; for example, they have completely taken over the academic sphere. They have also systematically eliminated media outlets. They have become a monopoly, so to speak. The main sources of information for people are the media and communication tools. And these are all under the control of this power. What is the intention, the purpose of this power? What policy does it follow regarding the Kurds, the PKK, or the Apoist movement? It determines the editorial line itself through the people it has appointed or through the people it employs in the media, which belong to it, and makes them say whatever it wants. Among the Kurdish people, especially the freedom guerrillas, the response is anger, nothing else.
As I said, after a while, it becomes impossible to follow. But we are not their target audience anyway. Their target audience is society. They are causing the greatest harm to Turkish society. We are also following it to a certain extent, wondering how much it is being watched. Is their audience very widespread? No, actually. It seems that this is not the case. They have reached rock bottom. The AKP has lowered quality standards in Turkey in so many areas. It has made everything substandard. It has, so to speak, placed a few universities in every city. In the past, universities, academics, and journalists had a certain weight and prestige. They were experts in their fields. Despite all their shortcomings, they could criticize. But the AKP government—due to its excessive authoritarianism—has committed too many crimes; to cover up these crimes, it greatly increased the level of poor quality. This is a fundamental characteristic of authoritarian powers. This poor quality is being transmitted to the public through the media. It is poisoning the public. Art is of poor quality, and it affects the public. Culture is the same. All their arguments are false. This is how perceptions have been formed.
Now, that was mainly a look at the mainstream media, which are controlled by the government; but how do you see the situation of the opposition media—except for the Kurdish media—which is currently facing serious repression?
It is common knowledge that Turkey has a serious democracy problem. The essence of the democratization problems it has experienced stems from the Kurdish issue. It is impossible for Turkey to democratize without resolving the Kurdish issue. What makes it so undemocratic, so oppressive, and so central to the struggle for power is essentially the Kurdish issue.
The approach of other political forces outside the current government to the Kurdish issue, the Kurds, and the Kurdistan freedom movement is more or less the same. Periodically, there may be different approaches for their own power calculations. This can influence their publications to a certain extent. But when the atmosphere changes slightly, their approach to the Kurds, the Kurdish freedom struggle, and Kurdish existence is not really that different, and it is essentially based on the same ideology of rigid denial and annihilation. That is the point where they converge.
The Kurds are currently the most fundamental force driving the struggle for democratization in Turkey. They are leading the struggle for democracy in Turkey. If there is any progress toward democratization in Turkey, it is the result of the Kurdish freedom struggle. Therefore, a certain degree of alliance is developing with the forces in opposition. This is reflected in elections and different alliances. These kinds of things make their media a bit different. But, for example, the ‘Peace and Democratic Society Process’ we are currently in… Turkey must change, the Middle East is changing, and we have changed. For example, we dissolved the PKK, the organization of our 52-year struggle. We have set an end to the armed struggle method we relied on to secure our existence. We are doing everything we can for the democratization of Turkey. Most recently, on July 11, a group of our comrades showed our approach to armed struggle. They showed everyone that they are ready for the democratic politics necessary for the democratization of Turkey. We have demonstrated how prepared we are for the framework we have formulated as democratic integration and freedom laws. Therefore, if the opposition has a democratization problem—which it does—it is currently being subjected to a trend of trustee politics. Democracy is most necessary for the opposition. It is not for the government!
In short, what I want to say is this: there is such an important process underway, but when you look at the approach of the so-called opposition media in this process, there is still a major discrepancy regarding their agenda and rhetoric.
This is an important point, as it concerns the strategy of your struggle. You talk about democracy and resolving the Kurdish question; how can this be guaranteed? Through the legal system in Turkey, for example?
There is no such thing as law in Turkey. Our fundamental concern in Turkey right now is how Turkey will become a state governed by the rule of law. Our struggles are for this. We have abandoned the approach of trying to destroy the state and replace it with something else. That is something that Kurdish people’s leader Abdullah Öcalan has explained widely. Our primary concern at present is the implementation of law. For example, our leader attributed the cause of the hotel fire in Bolu to the absence of the rule of law. Because there is no rule of law. There is no accountability. There are no rules or regulations. There are interests, power, and nepotism.
Erdoğan recently spoke of an alliance between Kurds, Turks, and Arabs. But there are no Kurds, so there can be no brotherhood. First, there must be legal recognition. Law describes the restrictions imposed on a state. A state governed by rules is a constitutional state. There are no rules in the current state. The fundamental reason for this rule-less state is the Kurdish issue. Because the state sees the Kurdish issue as its own existential problem. It has built its nation state on the absence of the Kurds. The Kurds are trying to exist, and the state is fighting against this. This time, within the framework of its official ideology, whoever attacks the Kurds, all the others become irrelevant. The phrase “when it comes to the homeland, everything else is secondary” essentially means “it is permissible to commit crimes against the Kurds. At this point, fulfill the requirements of the official ideology; after that, whether you become a mafia, a gang, or a thug, the path is open.” It is also open to the Kurds. Right now, the system has supposedly opened its doors to some Kurds that fit their picture.
Let me put it this way: the reason for all the current lawlessness and irregularities, including the inadequate media, is the absence of a form of the rule of law. The struggle we are currently waging is a struggle to establish a legal state. If this happens, Turkish society will benefit the most.
The unchanging rhetoric of the media has a twofold effect. One is its effect on the Kurds, the other on Turkey. Publishing this rhetoric deepens the existing distrust. We have suffered; we have been suffering for at least a hundred years. For at least a hundred years, we have been trying to make our existence accepted. And this has cost us perhaps millions of martyrs in total. Now, if you want to make peace, you need to engage in self-criticism. If you want to reach out to the Kurds, win their hearts, and make peace with them, you need to change your rhetoric. How can the Kurds make peace with people who, until yesterday, were cursing them in every way possible and who, today, apart from a few minor changes in their approach, have not made any fundamental changes and have not changed their mindset? Rhetoric is a form of expression of mentality. It did not change. There is a way in which this manifests itself on the Kurdish side. As you know, Kurds always approach things with suspicion and distrust. The Turkish state needs to reach the point where it sets aside all suspicion. The Kurds are no entity that should be viewed with suspicion from the perspective of the Turkish state. They are a people who have proven their existence at this stage and are simply trying to live as themselves. That is all. Therefore, the media must address the Kurds in an appropriate manner. Otherwise, this distrust will deepen. They are creating difficulties for themselves. They are making money from this. Making money from the blood of people, from the absence of another, is, to use religious terminology, the greatest sin.
Nevertheless, we believe that if the ruling powers did not play so much with the mentality of society, societies would essentially be egalitarian. Those peoples are neighbors after all. In normal social life, Turks and Kurds are, for the most part, very intertwined peoples, except for some fascists. They know each other. If their real concern is peace and building unity among peoples in the democratic process, if they no longer want to face what is called the Kurdish problem in Turkey, if they do not want to experience what they call a survival problem, then it is essential that they develop a discourse regarding both Turkish society and the Kurdish people. So first there must be reconciliation in rhetoric. There are certain requirements for the rhetoric of peace to emerge. We cannot say that everything is as it used to be, of course. There is a gradual change in discourse on this issue. But it is still very inadequate; they themselves lost control of the situation to a certain extent. They played too much with facts and truths. They relied too much on genocide and assimilation policies. They thought they would get results. They did everything they could to get the support of the people. But the struggle we waged put an end to that. Now they are somewhat confused about how to recover. It seems that they need a renewal of their personnel.
Source: ANF News
