Hasan Koçer, Deputy Co-Chair of the Executive Council of the Autonomous Administration of North and East Syria, spoke to ANF on the anniversary of the Rojava Revolution and shared his views on recent developments in Syria.
Part one of this interview can be read here.
Does the presence of ISIS in the region still pose a threat? What kind of contextual difficulties do the SDF face in their fight against ISIS?
The threat of ISIS existed even before the collapse of the Ba’ath regime, but after the formation of the new government in Syria, an environment of insecurity and instability developed. ISIS organized itself. They are currently organized in the desert region. They are organized within our areas. There have been multiple attacks on our Asayish (internal security) and military forces. Many of our people were martyred. They are martyring civilians. ISIS has revived and reorganized. If no international stance is taken against this, Syria will become a hub of terrorism. In other words, terrorist organizations will regroup and many states actually want this. They want to discipline the Syrian people through ISIS. Although ISIS was defeated, it has reorganized under current conditions and is now launching attacks from the desert into our regions. According to the latest information we have received, they are well-organized, they have even claimed that they will take control of some cities. It has reached this level. The international coalition must fulfill its responsibilities in this regard. They must clarify their position, especially toward the SDF and other forces that have fought against ISIS. If things continue like this, Syria will become a center for terrorism. Because ISIS has not been completely dismantled, thousands of its members are in detention, they are in the al-Hol camp. By now, the small children in the al-Hol camp have grown up; they are turning eighteen. It is not the same as before. For this reason, our people in the region must approach this with the necessary sensitivity, and international powers must continue their support for the SDF in the fight against ISIS.
We said it back then as well: A joint operations room could be established with the Damascus administration to fight against ISIS. Jointly fighting ISIS would be something that inspires confidence, but this has not happened so far. Meanwhile, ISIS continues to grow and organize itself. This is unacceptable. We will defend ourselves against this, but the international coalition must also fulfill its responsibilities.
At what stage are the talks with Damascus regarding the integration of the SDF and the Autonomous Administration into Syria? How would this integration affect the status of the SDF and the Autonomous Administration?
In Arabic, we refer to integration as demij. The alliance formed on March 10 essentially marks the beginning of this process. Our goal in Syria is to solve the Syrian issue together with the state. Our institutions should be integrated with state institutions, but this integration must occur in a way that preserves their distinct character and autonomy. Several delegations have met, and discussions have taken place. Some of these discussions yielded results, while others did not, because other forces were also involved and did not want the problem to be resolved. Our aim is to resolve the issue. We have no intention of establishing a new state or of dividing Syria, this has already been made clear in our previous initiatives. This is our strategy; we are not saying this merely as a political statement. Our strategy is built on this foundation, it is constructed upon the development of democratic autonomy.
We are basing our approach on democratic autonomy. There are certain matters that may be centrally tied to the state, and there are other matters that must be tied to the people of the region. As with the former Ba’ath regime, the state cannot interfere in everything. If this approach does not evolve, we will see a repeat of the old Ba’ath regime. Our integration is based on this foundation, and this is how we want it to develop.
Recently, several meetings were held, and delegations met to discuss various issues. Topics such as education, state-affiliated institutions, population registry, passports, and air travel were all discussed. These are centralized matters that can be managed jointly with the state. But things like municipalities, social institutions, assemblies, communes, and so on belong to society, any interference in these is unacceptable. There will be some institutions affiliated with the state, but certain matters must remain under the authority of the people of the region. When we talk about decentralization, this is what we mean. We are not talking about drawing borders, although some people misunderstand it that way!
So, for example, how will the people of Raqqa organize themselves? They have institutions, military forces, internal security, and mechanisms of protection, everything is organized by the people themselves. All of those carrying out these responsibilities are the people of Raqqa. It is unacceptable to send someone from outside without taking the identity and characteristics of these people into account.
What I want to emphasize is this: our integration will be based on resolving the issue. We have formed committees on this basis, an economic and financial committee, a health committee, and an education committee. These committees are in place. The Damascus government must overcome the mentality of the old Baath regime; centralization, as it was in the past, is no longer acceptable. If you noticed, no one was consulted regarding the constitution they announced. They supposedly held a “National Dialogue Conference,” but they did not ask us, nor did they consult others. They formed a government, appointed ministers, and yet the peoples here were not included at all, not even asked. Now they are discussing parliament and inviting some individuals from Raqqa, but these people do not represent the people; they represent only themselves. The approach of the new government is not right. This must be corrected. They must base their actions on the will of the people. You do all of this without asking anyone, and then if we speak about autonomy, you accuse us of “dividing the state”! So who is actually dividing the state in this scenario? Are these exclusionary approaches causing division, or is it the formation of an autonomous administration within the state structure that divides the state? These approaches are unacceptable. Integration will be based on this principle, and we will continue along this path, especially as two major international actors, France and the United States, are involved in the dialogue. International oversight is beneficial to clarify who adopts what stance during these negotiations and to ensure transparency. We will continue with these talks.
There is an ongoing Peace and Democratic Society Process being developed in Turkey. Within the framework of this process, what kind of political transformation do you expect Turkey to undergo in relation to the region?
In my opinion, the Kurdish question is a shared issue, it is not solely the problem of Rojava, nor is it only the problem of Northern Kurdistan (Bakur). The Kurdish issue is an international issue. Wherever it is resolved, it directly affects the other parts. Especially the Peace and Democratic Society Process initiated by Mr. Öcalan has an impact. It has revealed who supports war and how strongly Mr. Öcalan stands for peace, how he seeks to protect both the Kurdish and Turkish peoples, and even to preserve the integrity of the state. This call, and the many practical steps taken, have shown the entire world that military power, armed methods, and armed forces can only serve for self-defense, and that success cannot be achieved this way. A society can only become successful through political struggle, social struggle, and cultural struggle. Armed struggle can only be used for self-defense. If someone says, “I will succeed through armed struggle,” it is not possible. For example, even if two major powers go to war now, the level of destruction has reached such a point that even the winning side ultimately loses. In other words, there is no such thing as victory. Both the victor and the defeated face the same result because the world is no longer the same, and war is no longer what it used to be. That is why success cannot be gained through war, it can only be achieved through democratic political struggle.
Abdullah Öcalan laid out these principles and practical steps were taken, and this truly paved the way for the process. Now the Turkish state must also take some steps. If it remains one-sided, the issue will not be resolved. The Turkish state must act, not for narrow party interests, but for a democratic resolution. Neither Rojava nor the Kurds pose any threat. Historically, it is known that the Kurdish and Turkish peoples fought side by side in the Battle of Manzikert and many other battles, winning victories together. The brotherhood between the Kurdish and Turkish peoples is evident. Every time the Turkish state turned away from the Kurds, it suffered losses. Mr. Öcalan said, “Kurds cannot exist without Turks, and Turks cannot exist without Kurds.” If the Turkish state does not bring this process to a conclusion, it will be the one to lose. This has always been the case, during the Ottoman era, the Republic era, and now as well. This will also affect the Kurds of Rojava because Rojava and Northern Kurdistan Kurds are not separate they belong to the same nation. It is true that they have been divided among four states, but they are still one nation. Any step taken in Turkey directly affects Rojava. We must carefully understand how this process and this place will be affected. The current status of Rojava is not simply related to a change of government but essentially connected to the process developed by Mr. Öcalan. It has a very serious impact.
What is the current state of your efforts to achieve unity among Kurdish forces?
Our issue is not only related to Rojava; in fact, what is truly needed is a general national congress for the Kurds. Why do I say this? Because there have already been calls from Mr. Öcalan in the past, he even spoke about how Kurds should unite in the manifesto. A national congress is necessary for the Kurds. Why? Because the situation in the world is changing. Even if there are different ideas, Kurds must have a common discourse. Let the ideas be different, there should not be any absolutism trying to make all thoughts identical. But the red line for the Kurds must be a national stance. Kurds must have their own culture and national identity. Our focus should be on how to unify our discourse and protect the Kurdish people and culture. Our discourse as Kurds must be united, not fragmented. This is our fundamental goal. The conference held in Rojava was organized on this basis. It was decided that a committee would be formed and that this committee would go to Damascus on behalf of the Kurds to hold negotiations. Until now, the Damascus government has not invited this committee to talks, but the committee is ready. They must invite it in order to discuss the Kurdish question, because the March 10 agreement also included provisions for guaranteeing the rights of the Kurds in the constitution. In essence, the rights of the Kurds living in Rojava and Syria must be included in the constitution. What will be the structure of the state, its system, its national army? All of these issues must be discussed and resolved in order to achieve integration. If the constitution remains unclear, how will integration happen? What will we be integrating into? When the form of this government is still unknown, how can we join it? In order to join, all of this must be organized, and the committee formed to represent the Kurds must be sent. In line with the decision taken at the conference, this committee has already been formed.
The region is facing economic embargoes and trade restrictions imposed by neighboring countries. What steps are you taking to overcome these economic challenges?
This issue concerns all of Syria, it is not limited to Rojava alone, because Rojava and the regions of North and East Syria are part of Syria. Rojava and North and East Syria are open to the idea of opening border crossings in order to enable economic development, establish a flow of goods, allow for economic activity, and enable people to do business. However, the situation here is directly tied to the broader reality of Syria.
As you know, the sanctions and embargoes imposed on Syria have recently been lifted. But so far, there has not been any significant economic progress. If the borders were to open, many trade and economic issues might be resolved and we are open to that. We have previously stated very clearly that the Til Koçer border crossing should be opened, but it was not opened because international political powers did not want it and did not approve of it. Even now, we still call for the opening of these border crossings, the development of trade, and the free movement of people. Such steps would also lead to economic progress.
What outcomes have your efforts to increase the international recognition of the Rojava Revolution produced? How do you plan to further develop these efforts?
Previously, many discussions were held regarding how to introduce the Autonomous Administration diplomatically. The first step is for the Syrian state to recognize the Autonomous Administration, that is, to secure its legitimacy through constitutional guarantees. This remains our primary goal. Even before, efforts and struggles were being carried out to secure recognition for the Autonomous Administration, and these efforts continue today. In terms of diplomacy, the struggle and work carried out on the ground, and the war fought against ISIS, the Rojava Revolution has had a serious impact on the international public, not necessarily on international states, but on societies. We are continuing these efforts. Discussions are being held with democratic forces, democratic parties, leftist parties, and other political groups. But as I mentioned, we cannot view North and East Syria in isolation from Syria as a whole. The issue of recognition must first be resolved with the Syrian state. Our rights must be constitutionally guaranteed within the Syrian constitution, and a broader agreement must be reached throughout Syria on this basis. This is our main objective.
Do you have a message for younger generations about embracing the legacy of the Rojava Revolution? How do you involve them in this process?
What I would like to say to the youth is this: Women and young people are the pioneers of our revolution. This is not merely a theoretical statement, it is a fact in practice. This revolution will achieve victory under the leadership of women and youth. Mr. Öcalan has developed a new manifesto. The youth must understand this manifesto well. It is a new manifesto, a new revolution. They must participate in it with great strength. It is true that a powerful special warfare is being waged specifically against the youth. They want to mislead them, to distance them from the right dynamism and the right mindset. Just as the youth played a strong role in the first manifesto and helped sustain this revolution for 52 years, now they must engage with this new manifesto and help expand the legacy of the revolution so that we can establish a free and democratic system. That is our primary goal. In Rojava as well, youth must lead in participating in the democratic system and engage in it with strength. The more organized the youth are in a society, the more organized that society will be. The more organized and free women are, the more organized and free that society will be. In our 13 years of struggle in Rojava, building upon a legacy that existed even before the revolution, the youth must not let go of this banner. The flag of struggle must continue to be raised, and we must carry our struggle to success.
Source: ANF News
